Owner Driver rule

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Postby Guest » Thu Feb 27, 2003 10:38 pm

I used to be opposed to such a rule. Now i'm not so sure. I would hate to see things get to the point where the only way the average guy can be competitive is to crew on his own boat.

From a regatta by regatta perspective I really don't care what goes on on another boat. But with a circuit with multiple regattas, I'm no longer sure who I'm racing against. If my friend beats me in 4 of the circuit stops & then I sail with Ken & Brad Read for one reggata and end up being ahead overall, was that fair to him? Does it matter if they were on my boat but I drove with the same results?

Right now I know I'm not close to pocketing any big dollar purses, so beating other boats is all self esteem.

I'm curious what other people are thinking

Ghost Dancing

Postby Guest » Fri Feb 28, 2003 9:10 am

In a sense we do have an owner-driver rule, in that only non-pros or owners can drive in "member" events. This has been interpreted to mean that as long as a pro owns a J-80 he can steer one (his or another) in member events. This rule applies to people like Kerry Klingler, Jay Lutz, etc. If the class wants to alter this rule (or any other rule) it can be passed through the appropriate channels.
There is no restriction on pros sailing in these events as long as they do not drive. In general, I think having a pro on board for one or two events can elevate your game if you treat it as a learning experience. I am not sure it is in the best interest of the class to have pros crew on one boat on a regular basis, unless they happen to own the boat and campaign it themselves, but that is just my personal opinion...

Postby Guest » Fri Feb 28, 2003 10:30 am

We could cover this in the NOC next year by scoring the driver's performance regardless of what boat he is on.

Postby Guest » Fri Feb 28, 2003 10:40 am

Along the same lines of thinking, it would be consistent to enter the helmsperson's name in the column labeled "helm" in the results page of the Southern Circuit's first race.

Postby Guest » Fri Feb 28, 2003 6:55 pm

As I understand it there are pros and then there are pros. A pro is defined as anyone who makes a living in the sailing industry. There is a quasi-pro clasification but in general, if you are a sailing instructor, or a rigger, or do boat deliveries for pay, you are a pro. Its not just the sailmakers. On the other hand you could be a college all-american with olympic aspirations but as long as you are not paid for it, you are an amateur. Most of the people that are classified as pros are no more skilled or accomplished than the top amateurs in our fleet. My opinion is that trying to regulate their participation as crew would be a mistake.

Postby Guest » Fri Feb 28, 2003 7:55 pm

I think of boats as teams. When the team is fairly constant, it doesn't matter at all who's driving, and it doesn't matter how good some of the people on the team are.

Likewise, in single regattas, its a team for a day. The circuit gets odder to call, since multiple events all add together. If a "pro" however you want to define it, moved from one boat to another for different races in a regatta, a whole bunch of us would be bristling

I like Chris's idea of awarding the race results to the driver. It seems to provide a nice balance


Postby Guest » Sun Mar 02, 2003 11:58 am

Here you are right, there are pros and there are pros. I've been told that the difference between an amature and a professional athlete is 10,000 hours of practice. As far as the RRS goes it covers anyone making money from the service of racing boats. Getting comissions from sales of sails to race boats qualifies. Getting expenses paid to deliver the boat does not in itself. Neither does getting paid to paint the bottom.
Some consider me a pro because I work as a sail consultant. I am a good sailor because I have put in the time. I race with my wife and friends, not rock stars or people selected for a certain weight. I would wish for crew willing to put in the time to practice and get closer to that 10,000 hour mark. I have scheduled Fridays off through the summer in order to practice for the upcomming World's, at the venue it will be held. What about you?
Tom Gore
#36 Javelin

Postby Guest » Sun Mar 02, 2003 2:57 pm


Six days is a long way to haul a J80. Probably burn 400 gallons of gas! Checked off the Worlds in Newport a couple of years ago, in that crowd I'm definitely a goober.

I like to travel, but with a 600Lb centerboard dinghy. Sounds like you'll get a great turnout what with your large local presence and the growing population of road warriers.

For me, the J80 is a nice boat for the lake and the weekly fleet racing is enough.

Thanks for the personal invitation and best of luck with your campaign,


Postby Guest » Sun Mar 02, 2003 10:28 pm

Bob Lemaire,

What lake do you race on and how many J80s are in your fleet?

Bob Leonard

Postby Guest » Sun Mar 02, 2003 10:54 pm


Fleet 1 is on Lake Winnipesaukee in New Hampshire, one of the largest lakes in the state. We have 12 boats and I think at least one more coming this summer. Racing is Thursday nights from mid May through mid October. More at www.lwsa.org

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